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Discussion Starter #1
This is being posted in "Anything Goes," so it should be okay here.

I must say that I joined this forum for a few reasons. One, the wealth of information to be found here about our cute little babies, and two, the overall environment of camaraderie and goodwill that pervades this forum, as opposed to that "other" forum about Maltese.

However, lately, I have noticed that this board has become divided into little cliques, almost like in high school, where if one does not conform to that group's beliefs, attitudes, or style, then the group shuns her, or even picks on her. Now I admit that I have been involved in some of these little spats in the past, but even after I have been laying low, I still see it going on. This means that the problem is still out there.

While I am not naive enough as to believe that we will all get along on here like we were the animatronic robots in Disney's It's A Small World, I still think that we can operate with as much of a sense of harmony as possible if a few things changed:

1. If someone in your clique posts something and someone from another clique disagrees with it, just let it be. Too often I see this happen, and then Clique A calls Clique B's post a "personal attack." However, if Clique A replies with an equally snide post, that is characterized as Clique A "defending herself." HA! The hypocrisy here is almost unbearable.

2. As has been stated before, we should all use the PM feature a lot more.

At the risk of starting something seen on Judge Judy, I was totally blown away by how the whole Spottypoo vs. DoctorCathy war played out. Granted, things were said by both sides that were in poor taste (whether they were edited out by the poster herself or by Joe), but I think that this is an example of one clique ganging up on another. Both parties were equally wrong here, yet only one was publicly chastised for it. No, I did not read the "evil" post by DoctorCathy that was edited by Joe, but from what I heard it said something that was no more scandalous than Spottypoo telling Mee (an innocent bystander) to "bite me!"

Joe, this is your forum and you certainly have the right to run it any way that you want, but in my humble opinion, if you start taking sides like that, then you run the risk of turning what was once a great forum into something exactly like "that other guy's forum." Just look at how bold Spottypoo got in her subsequent posts after she saw she had an endorsement from the Administrator! This damages the "safe" feeling that refugees from the other site came here seeking. Soon enough, this forum will be exactly like the other one, where a certain group of "regulars" start snapping at any newbies who post contrary to their beliefs.

I understand that many feelings were hurt here, and that some things were said that may not be forgivable, but if we just move on without addressing what went wrong here, then these kinds of episodes will keep happening, and I know that Joe does not want that. We should all just leave the bad things from our days at the door, and when we log on to this great forum, we should just be allowed to post our beliefs and agree to disagree at the end of the day.

Let's not forget the reason why we are all gathered here in the first place:



 

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Bravo!!! Bravo!!! I had no idea I could come to this forum and get such easy answers to life's little problems in addition to advice about my maltese. Man, I am more glad now to be a member than ever!!
 

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Originally posted by MaltTease@Jun 6 2005, 08:28 PM
Joe, this is your forum and you certainly have the right to run it any way that you want, but in my humble opinion, if you start taking sides like that, then you run the risk of turning what was once a great forum into something exactly like "that other guy's forum."
first of all I dont take sides, I dont recognize cliques or groups, I do what I need to do to protect SM and individual users from personal attacks, the best I can, the only way I know how, whether that means editing a post, deleting it or more, SM continues to grow in members, threads and posts, I do the best I can to run it by myself to this point, thats all I can do, the members here are great but we are made up of a diverse group of people like any other community on the internet and there will be differences in opinions, thoughts, ideas, upbringing, culture and more so trusy me, I'm not niave enought to think there will never be problems, there will be

I own forums much larger than this that started just like SM, one forum is now at close to 10,000 members and over 600,000 posts, so I am used to almost anything that can be thrown at me, I have banned people, deleted posts, deleted threads, asked people to not visit my sites, I have faced things outside of the forums that users would never believe I had to deal with

all in all I do the best I can, I try to be fair, I try to allow freedom to each and everyone who posts but at the same time I do what I need to do no matter how cold and calculating it may seem to some

and two, the overall environment of camaraderie and goodwill that pervades this forum, as opposed to that "other" forum about Maltese.[/B]
unfortunately for me and Jay at MO there are only two major Maltese forums, mine and his, we both run ours in distinctivley different ways, this appeals to members in many different ways but at the same time give everyone a choice in where they would like to post, MO will drive members here and SM will drive members there, SM will not be for everyone but I welcome everyone and give them a chance they may not get elsewhere to find out, friendships will be born, cliques will be born, people will get mad, pissed and leave, I hate to see it happen but all of this will, I'm a realist and have been in the internet business for so long that I know all of this will happen, SM will even suffer but I will do my best by each member, each thread and each post that I can, thats all I can promise, thats all I will ever promise

1. If someone in your clique posts something and someone from another clique disagrees with it, just let it be. Too often I see this happen, and then Clique A calls Clique B's post a "personal attack." However, if Clique A replies with an equally snide post, that is characterized as Clique A "defending herself." HA! The hypocrisy here is almost unbearable.[/B]
I'll agree to disagree, sometimes this happens but rest assured I am no part of any clique, I discourage them if I can and encourage individuality and a open and honest forum, I call a personal attack just that, a "personal" attack, I dont discriminate, if I see it I deal with it the best I can regardless of the member, their post count, their status amongst others, I have PM'd many members here with different issues, only one that I can recall did I feel the need to take care of in the public forums, my style of admistration will not sit well with some, some will love it but I can only do what I know how, when I feel best to do it

No, I did not read the "evil" post by DoctorCathy that was edited by Joe, but from what I heard it said something that was no more scandalous than Spottypoo telling Mee (an innocent bystander) to "bite me!"[/B]
well you have the right to your opinion as does everyone here but the two were nowhere near the same, spottypoo made her statement that was followed by a laughing smilie, every forum I own or belong too distinguishes rwal thoughts with sarcasm and funny posts by what is followed by the post, most of the time if there is nothing and it is a stern post, then its read as real emotion, if it is followed by certain smilies it is read as a joke or simple sarcasm, there was NOTHING funny about one members posts and the others was somewhat questionable because it was followed by smilies, the internet drains us of emotion and feeling because there isnt a person to person contact, one persons humor is completely dry to someone else, sarcasm is read as complete seriousness when it shouldnt be, complete seriuosness is sometime mistaken for something funny, it is very hard to discern what one person mean from another and I am thrust into a postition where I must figure out the best I can which each means

I only ask members to do the best they can to understand each other, each others cultures, each others up bringings, each others thoughts and ideas and treat them with respect that they would appreciate themselves

I must say that SM is very trying for me sometimes because our Malts are a part of each of our families and each subject, each dscussion has the ability to cross boundries with someone else because of its delicate nature but I commend each and everyone for doing the best they can, being an adult and refraining from attacks on another based off of their beliefs compared to anothers, and I thank each of you for being adults and respecting each other no matter how hard it may be, for all of us


I understand that many feelings were hurt here, and that some things were said that may not be forgivable, but if we just move on without addressing what went wrong here, then these kinds of episodes will keep happening, and I know that Joe does not want that. We should all just leave the bad things from our days at the door, and when we log on to this great forum, we should just be allowed to post our beliefs and agree to disagree at the end of the day.[/B]
I will disagree, I think we should address problems or disagreements but there is a avenue that doesnt get used much, the PM, for which these things should be discussed, when things get personal, keep it personal, we are adults and should act like one, it should never get to the point of sides being drawn or cliques coming into play, some people should be adult enough to not reply to certain things, adult enough to PM a member and ask "what did you mean" or simply ask me to look at a thread if its got out of hand, I am only one person and to be honest I read about 1/2 of the thread here, if that many and I deal with problems as I can but I am always available to each one of you if you need me, even if I dont respond right away

and you are right, we should be able to post our beliefs, you can visit many forums and not find the freedom you will here at SM but trust me, I wont just let "anything" fly, there are boundries and as unpopular as it may make me to some I will always do what I have to, you can ask many here, I have done things to help them and I have done things to scorn them but I will always be as fair as I can to everyone

Last but not least, I thank all of you ladies (and the few gents) for making this a great place, you stress me out, you make laugh, you make me mad but you make me smile, SM has some of the greatest members I have ever delt with and I'm glad to have each of you here, we all could (me included) do things to make SM better, make ourselves better people and to take a second to consider others but I couldnt ask for a bunch of greater people

 

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to Joe!
 

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I second that, here's to Joe, you certainly have your hands full, and deserve another

Thank you for a wonderful site, I have had so much fun since joining in here. I
this site.
 

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I don't have much to add here but I LOVE PM. I use it all the time and I love all the PMs I get. I am here to share my happy times and share my knowledge of the breed.

There are things I don't agree it and things I agree with but I am learning to stay out of it. No doubt, I have said some very mean things in the past but I still stand by my views.

It is a reality that there are cliques and groups. We are humans and can't blindly conform. There is no reason we should either. So I say .. let's go on sharing our opinions but let's try to do it nicely.

We are all here to help. If someone doesn't want help or advice, don't post. If someone is here only looking for people to agree with them, don't post. If you are here to learn and to share, I will be more than happy to participate.
 

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Too often I see this happen, and then Clique A calls Clique B's post a "personal attack." However, if Clique A replies with an equally snide post, that is characterized as Clique A "defending herself." HA! The hypocrisy here is almost unbearable.[/B]
Both parties were equally wrong here, yet only one was publicly chastised for it. No, I did not read the "evil" post by DoctorCathy that was edited by Joe, but from what I heard it said something that was no more scandalous than Spottypoo telling Mee (an innocent bystander) to "bite me!"[/B]
Just look at how bold Spottypoo got in her subsequent posts after she saw she had an endorsement from the Administrator![/B]

just wanted to quote a few things that i totally love you for
thanks for saying something.. hopefully it clears the air a little hah.


and... THAT DOG IS SO CUTE.
 

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I just wanted to add that I love It's a Small World at Disneyland, and I get most of my attitude from Judge Judy


~Elegant
 

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Thanks Joe--we needed that!!! This is the best site ever and I'm so happy we can get back to normal--(whatever that is
) We appreciate your hard work!
 

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I think there are good points made by everyone here. In the past, I have definitely felt as though some people were in cliques. For instance, in the past, when I posted my opinions here about backyard breeders (from having a personal experience with a dog with multiple problems), it seemed as though people would applause each others responses and were generally unfriendly. Someone even mentioned "condescending" and some other things I wasn't sure actually applied to me. I realize my opinions/thoughts differed from others but I was polite and only stating what I thought was right. I never meant to insult anyone. However, just because I had a different opinion did not mean that I was trying to be rude. We don't always have to agree on everything.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Originally posted by puppylucy@Jun 6 2005, 08:19 PM
QUOTE
Too often I see this happen, and then Clique A calls Clique B's post a "personal attack." However, if Clique A replies with an equally snide post, that is characterized as Clique A "defending herself." HA! The hypocrisy here is almost unbearable.
Both parties were equally wrong here, yet only one was publicly chastised for it. No, I did not read the "evil" post by DoctorCathy that was edited by Joe, but from what I heard it said something that was no more scandalous than Spottypoo telling Mee (an innocent bystander) to "bite me!"[/B]
Just look at how bold Spottypoo got in her subsequent posts after she saw she had an endorsement from the Administrator![/B]

just wanted to quote a few things that i totally love you for
thanks for saying something.. hopefully it clears the air a little hah.


and... THAT DOG IS SO CUTE.
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=69862
[/B][/QUOTE]

Thank you! I've always thought yours was cute, too!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Joe, thank you for answering my post and clarifying your stance on things. Also, thank you for working so hard to bring us a place to have these discussions. It's easy for us to forget sometimes how much work it takes!
 

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Joe, your response was very well said. I like the way you think!!


I'm sorry you were put in the position of having to defend yourself and this forum.
 

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Joe had this wonderful advice for us just a month ago. I think it's worth repeating.

I interupt this thread to bring you this special announcement.

PLEASE: be adults, if that is a stretch please at least act it!

I try to be fair, I try not to "Moderate" in a way that takes away from the openous and freedom of our speech and rights to it but please the name calling, attitudes and bickering is so third grade. I'm not pointing fingers, calling anyone out or even being specific to this thread, I havent read it all but I am in the unfortunate position to have to tell some of you that you need to grow up. This is silly.

#1: if you have something personal with a poster here, take it to a PM or email
#2: as an alternative, be the bigger person and walk away from anyone immature enough to "get personal"
#3: did I say grow up yet?
#4: either "be or "act" like an adult and use that to diffuse a situation and get back on tract (thank you to those who do try)

We are all different, have different lives, different thoughts, different ways of communicating and different ways of understanding. The interenet and loss of "human" communication makes it that much harder to decipher sometimes. Please just do your best.

It seems weekly I am seeing more and more of this, may be time to reconsider putting a moderation team in place.

and sometimes all it takes is to bight your lip and not say anything

***********************************************************

I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread
 

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I sure feel like I've missed a lot in a week....
Trying to catch up is so hard!

I enjoy this forum tremendously. Just think, folks, if we all agreed 100% of the time it would be boring. Meanwhile, I like the idea of sticking to the subject matter of a thread and not getting personal.

Joe, thanks again for all that you do!
 
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